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windwaker
(Just popping in)


Joined: 2006/9/20
Posts: 4

Posted on: 2006/9/24 6:54

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
That's logical fallacy, mrmagic. I have to donate to suggest why I don't like what he's doing with the project? I have to support the president to say he's doing a bad job?

I am happy with what I get (or got, so far). I used Yamipod for a while and really liked it, up until this iTunes 7 thing. Then I realized it wasn't open source.

Consider this; have you heard of the genius program foobar2000? It's insanely customizable, and has its own database format for storing the location of mp3's. It, of course, supports audioscrobbler, freedb, etc. But what would it be if it wasn't open source? Not even database management would exist, it would just be a sub-par music player. Open sourcing is a change that can be made at any stage of a project, and opens up your community to even more programmers.

If you want people to donate, you have to be fair to the community yourself. Open the source to everyone.
Posted on: 2006/9/24 7:58

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
As a long time Linux user, I can say without bias that the OSS Community is entirely too opinionated, and too strong-willed with their opinions at that. This is not a standards committee. This is not a political debate. This is a program that someone wrote for themselves, and was generous enough to share for free. He doesn't owe you, or the community, anything. If you want to suggest he open up the source - fine. If you want to list the reasons why it would be beneficial to everyone if he did so - go ahead. Anything else is inappropiate and unwanted. Everything does NOT have to be open sourced. If you think not using a program because it's closed sourced is actually a legitamate reason, then you're what people are referring to when they use the word 'zealot'. I don't see exactly how you justify calling yourself a "victim". I don't recall reading anywhere on my iPod box a guarantee that YamiPod will work for us. It's a third party program people. If anything, your issue is with Apple, not him.

This is exactly why nobody listens to the OSS Community - nobody likes being preached to all the damn time.

p.s., Since you cited Foobar2000 in support of your argument, how about you tell them about MPlayer. The project was completely ripped off by other programs on numerous occasions, most notably Xine. It got so frustrating that the original author quit. I guess it was hard for him to be the best program available with people copying his code and claiming it as their own.
mpalves
(Just popping in)


Joined: 2006/9/15
Posts: 2

Posted on: 2006/9/24 19:39

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
windwaker: no offense intended, but Tomas developed the application, it's his option (and his alone) to open the source or not. He must have his reasons, and we can agree or not with his decision, but the bottom line is that it's his work, it's up to him to decide. It's up to us to respect it.

Personally, I'd like to see YamiPod turn into a open-source project, so that I'd be able to contribute to its development. I have a 5th gen iPod video, so I'm able to test the app on it. But it's not my project. By the way, thank you Tomas (once again) for such a great idea and a great program.
mrmagic526
(Just popping in)


Joined: 2006/9/24
Posts: 3

Posted on: 2006/9/24 20:43

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
I didn't mean you had to vote for the pres.... I'm just saying that the people who don't vote have no right to complain period.... I don't care who they vote for. They threw away any freedom of speach when they didn't vote. The same goes for unsupportive crybabies of software they use.
windwaker
(Just popping in)


Joined: 2006/9/20
Posts: 4

Posted on: 2006/9/25 1:11

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
mrmagic: yes, but you made an analogy that donating = voting. So you're saying that I have to donate to be able to say that I don't like what he's doing.

Anyone who lops people who are for open source software into a community doesn't know what they're taking about; it should be taken on a case by case basis. I was simply listing the reasons yamipod should be open source. Of course it's his choice, he wrote it, however it's less work for everyone if he opens the workload to everyone by making it open source. I can see no reason why not to do this, and he has given a whopping zero reasons besides "I'd rather not".
yamipod
(Webmaster)


Joined: 2005/1/18
Posts: 793

Posted on: 2006/9/26 0:14

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
Here are some reasons to not opensource YamiPod.
First of all it is written in REALBasic which is a beautiful objet oriented language. It is an extremely productive language similar to VB but with some great extra features: it builds everything in a compact single binary, it has linux support (which is getting better and better). Nevertheless it has some limitations.
REALBasic is not free, this is in my opinion the main reason to not opensource it. You should get a license to contribute to YamiPod if don't have one, while existing REALBasic users aren't very opensource oriented (except some rare exceptions). I doubt people would spend 99$ just to get a license to help YamiPod. Besides there's no good enough CVS support, even if last versions are trying to fill this gap, which would make managing the project even more time consuming.
From the pure programming side you'll need to have some RB experience to write good code (quite obvious, I know, but with RB it's more the case), especially when it comes to make something that works under mac/linux/windows. The part that writes and reads the iPod database needs experience as well, you may be able to make your iPod video work but this may break some other models.

I'm not totally new to OSS world as after starting YamiPod I wrote some GPL software (in C++) and actively and interestedly follow the movement. These are all good enough reasons for rather not opening sources and seeing code rip off here and there, maybe even in some shareware software. I may change my mind in future, one never knows, but not now.

About the fundraise no one is forced to donate, I though it wouldn't be unfair to ask for a small contribution if you use it on a regular basis. From the very few donations received I guess many people don't agree, unfortunately.


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mrmagic526
(Just popping in)


Joined: 2006/9/24
Posts: 3

Posted on: 2006/9/26 5:28

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
sent you aproximately $20 us dollars which worked out to be 15 euro's.
windwaker
(Just popping in)


Joined: 2006/9/20
Posts: 4

Posted on: 2006/9/27 6:40

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
If you need any more help, ml_ipod, an ipod managing plugin for winamp, is open source:

http://www.mlipod.com/
Prodoc
(Not too shy to talk)


Joined: 2006/2/19
Posts: 22

Posted on: 2006/10/24 15:28

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
Quote:
windwaker wrote:
I honestly think you just want the credit for yourself.
Can you blame him being the author of the program?! A program you can use for FREE!

Quote:
windwaker wrote:
There's no good argument here for not opening the source.
You not being the author is a pretty good one I think.

Quote:
windwaker wrote:
It's being unfair to your userbase, and in the end, WE are the victim.
Forcing the program to become opensource is what's realy unfair.
I like the concept of software being opensource but that doesn't mean I won't use software which isn't. It's a decision only the author has the right to make, for what ever reason he sees fit. After all, you are not the one putting effort in creating a similar program. It's takes a lot of time doing so, time you could have spend making money as well. Instead, the author of YamiPod decided making a nice program for all of us to use for FREE.

Please be reasonable and stop this discussion, try looking it from a the creators point of view as well instead of only your own.
Prodoc
(Not too shy to talk)


Joined: 2006/2/19
Posts: 22

Posted on: 2006/10/24 15:41

Re: ITUNES 7 (UNSUPPORTED FIRMWARE) FUNDRAISE
Quote:
windwaker wrote:
Consider this; have you heard of the genius program foobar2000? It's insanely customizable, and has its own database format for storing the location of mp3's. It, of course, supports audioscrobbler, freedb, etc. But what would it be if it wasn't open source?

...and just for the record, foobar2000 isn't opensource at all and will probably, and luckily, never be for good reasons...
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